JUDGE AND PROFESSOR: Pierce Lively '43
explains a point while Dan Stroup looks on. The
two have team-taught classes for several years.

Here Comes the Judge

It's not just lawyers who should care about the courts. Judicial decisions affect the lives of all Americans.

"Judges are very powerful," says Beth Mayer '02, a government and history major now working for a bank in Bloomington, Ind. "When you consider cases like Roe v. Wade you realize just how much they can change your life."

Students such as Mayer have an unusual opportunity at Centre to learn how the courts really work. For the last few years, Pierce Lively '43, a retired federal judge whose opinions are frequently cited in law textbooks, has joined government professor Dan Stroup in teaching a course on constitutional law and another on civil liberties.

"Nearly every undergraduate political science department has a course in constitutional law," notes Stroup. "Few, if any, outside Centre have an undergraduate course team-taught by a retired federal circuit court judge. Many of Judge Lively's colleagues have gone on to teach courses at law schools. I know of none who teach at the undergraduate level."

In response, Lively points out that he is "particularly pleased" that, like Mayer, many in the classes plan careers other than law.

"I'm much more interested in seeing undergraduates develop an interest in how our government works," he says. Lively had been a general-practice lawyer for more than two decades when President Nixon tapped him for the U.S. Court of Appeals for the Sixth Circuit in 1972. (He was elevated to chief judge in 1983.) In 25 years on the bench, he earned a reputation for precise reasoning, clear writing, and courteous demeanor. His court heard appeals from federal trial courts in Kentucky, Ohio, Michigan, and Tennessee; Lively himself participated in more than 5,000 cases often dealing with the thorniest of issues‹abortion rights, school textbooks, the death penalty, busing and desegregation‹from all four states. Many of his rulings still stand (although he modestly points out that he has also been overruled by the Supreme Court).

"Judge Lively provides background that cannot be recreated in any textbook," says Benjamin Beaton '03, a government major from Paducah, Ky., who took both courses. "It was both exciting and a little humbling to study cases he decided during his career."

Lively admits to a bit of apprehension before first joining the class back in 1998. "After all, I'm not an academic person," he says. "I'm just a guy who has worked with the law a long time."

Perhaps it helped that he had been a periodic visitor to Stroup's classes over the years. The two also share a connection to the University of Virginia, where Lively earned his law degree and Stroup, a master's and doctorate.

The reading lists for both classes feature decisions handed down by the Supreme Court. Students write their own legal opinions in the constitutional law class for cases that either are on their way to the high court or could be. The civil liberties class assigns students to roles as either judges or lawyers arguing before the court. And students quickly discover that justice is far more than words on a page. It does, in fact, involve judgment.

"In retrospect, [the court's] opinions may appear to be the right answer, but when you have to make the decision yourself, at the moment, it's not so clear," Stroup points out. "Judge Lively reinforces that by talking about the issues he has had to deal with as he has made these decisions."

Another dimension Lively brings is first-hand knowledge of the judicial process. "We talk about the whole collective decision making process in the circuit court: those three judges talking with each other trying to decide, "Stroup says. (A three-judge team hears each case on the circuit-court level.) "I think this is a much more effective and accurate way of dealing with the whole question of judicial process than you find in most political science courses, which keep statistics on judges' votes and try to predict how they're going to vote."

Students clearly appreciate the opportunity a team-taught class offers for two perspectives.

"It was interesting to see Dr. Stroup and Judge Lively talk about civil rights issues," recalls Mayer. "Dr. Stroup grew up in it . . . but Judge Lively was already grown and saw it as a lawyer. He told us that our hearts might tell us one thing, but the law might be different. It seems hard to reconcile those two. But he showed us you can change the world by the rule of law."

Kathryn Roe Eldridge '00, now in her third year of law school at Washington and Lee University, agrees.

"Both Judge Lively and Dr. Stroup gave me a phenomenal insight into the workings of the judiciary and the legal system," says Eldridge.

"I learned a good lesson, "she adds. "Judges are human, and their decisions often reflect their experiences."

It may be that Lively's most significant contribution to the Centre curriculum is the human face he puts to discussions of great issues.

"Judge Lively provided personal and professional insight into the practical application of Supreme Court decisions in the Danville community as a lawyer, parent, and judge, "says Beaton, who hopes to be a judge himself one day. "He told us of presiding over a P.T.A. when the Danville schools were integrated, and we read cases he decided that dealt with controversial issues such as busing and school funding."

But Beaton adds that whether as future judges––or just more informed citizens––students also take away a notion of what it means to be a Centre alumnus.

"Judge Lively has the talent and credentials to teach at a top-notch law school anywhere in the country, and he has chosen to spend his time with undergraduates here at Centre, "Beaton points out.

"It says a lot about his devotion for his alma mater."

––D.F.J.

Jamey Leahey '92, College lawyer and co-pre-law advisor, interviewed fellow pre-law advisor Dan Stroup and Pierce Lively '43 for this story.



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